Meetings

Witnesses:

·         Edwina Hart AM, Minister for Economy, Science and Transport, Welsh Government

·         James Price, Director General, Economy, Science and Transport,  Welsh Government

·         Rob Hunter, Director, Finance and Performance,  Welsh Government

Supporting documents:

Private paper (Members’ Brief for Item 6)

EBC(4)-05-14(p.4) – Budget Scrutiny - Letter from the Chair to the Minister dated 10 December 2013

EBC(4)-05-14(p.5) – Budget Scrutiny - The Minister’s response dated 14 January 2014

EBC(4)-05-14(p.6) - Budget Scrutiny - further letter from the Minister to the Chair dated 4 February 2014

EBC(4)-05-14(p.7) – Budget Scrutiny - Memorandum  2013-14

EBC(4)-05-14(p.8) - Note on the changes to the allocations in comparison to the First Supplementary budget

EBC(4)-38-13(p.6) - Six Months Updates - Rail Priorities, M4, Transport Priorities and Commitments

6.1 The Committee took evidence from the Minister for Economy, Science and Transport, Welsh Government. The Minister was supported by James Price, Director General, Economy, Science and Transport, Welsh Government and Rob Hunter, Director, Finance and Performance, Welsh Government

6.2 The Minister agreed to provide:

- details of the transfers made in the 2012-2013 transport budget and the basis on which the additional transport investments were prioritised;

- a collated summary of the breakdowns of the cost per job figures to show which type of business or financial support delivers the greatest return on investment and a note setting out how return on investment is assessed by the Department for EST (for example through the use of investment panels and WIDAB);

- a breakdown of how much of the £1.6million of efficiency savings in the delivery of the Superfast Cymru project were achieved by removing external consultancy fees;

- inclusion of the Programme for Government transport indicators within the Minister’s next six-monthly update, with commentary summarising the impact of policy.

6.3 The Minister also agreed that the annual update for economy and science would clearly show, at action level, the jobs and investment induced outputs that were achieved in 2013-14, along with the expenditure associated with achieving those outputs. In light of the fact that jobs assisted are achieved with no Welsh Government expenditure, the Committee would appreciate it if the jobs outputs were broken down to show separately jobs created, safeguarded and assisted.

FIN(4) 13-12 – Paper 1

2.1 The Committee considered the recommendations of its Welsh Government draft budget 2012-13 report and the response from the Minister for Finance.

2.2 The Committee agreed to write to the Welsh Government requesting:

·         A note explaining why the Minister has chosen to update the Committee with quarterly reports;

·         Clarification on the role of the delivery unit;

5.1 The Committee discussed the evidence on Welsh Government Supplementary Budget 2012-2013 (Summer 2012)

FIN(4) 11-12 – Paper 1 – Supplementary Budget 2012-2013 – Explanatory note

FIN(4) 11-12 – Paper 2 – Supplementary Budget 2012-2013 - Motion

Jane Hutt, Minister for Finance
Jeff Andrews, Specialist policy Adviser
Margaret Davies, Head of Budget Policy
Matthew Denham-Jones, Head of Budgetary Control and Reporting

2.1 The Chair welcomed Jane Hutt AM, Minister for Finance; Jeff Andrews, Specialist Policy Adviser; Margaret Davies, Head of Budget Policy; and Matthew Denham Jones, Head of Budgetary Control and Reporting.

2.2 Members scrutinised the Minister.

Action points:

The Welsh Government agreed to:

• Publish details of projects receiving funding from round 6 of Invest-to-Save, including how much each project received, the projected savings, details of the pay-back profile, and details of the forthcoming evaluation of Invest-to-Save;
• Provide clarification on the £1million investment in the Single Environmental Body, which was raised by the Environment and Sustainability Committee at its meeting on 27 June 2012;
• Confirm when the Committee will receive a year-end report detailing variations between actual spend and the last supplementary budget of the year.

HSC(4)-01-12 paper 5

NDM4870 Jane Hutt (Vale of Glamorgan)

To propose that the National Assembly for Wales, in accordance with Standing Order 20.25:

Approves the Annual Budget for the financial year 2012-2013 laid in the Table Office by the Minister for Finance and Leader of the House on 29 November 2011.

Footnote:

In accordance with the relevant provisions contained in the Government of Wales Act 2006 and Standing Order 20.28, the Annual Budget comprises the following information:

1. the written statement required under section 125(3) of the Government of Wales Act;

2. the resources agreed by the Treasury for the Welsh block budget for the financial year covered by the motion;

3. a reconciliation between the resources allocated to the Welsh block budget by the Treasury and the resources to be authorised for use in the motion;

4. a reconciliation between the estimated amounts to be paid into the Welsh Consolidated Fund by the Secretary of State and the amounts to be authorised for payment out of the Fund in the motion; and

5. a reconciliation between the resources to be authorised under section 125(1)(a) and (b) of the Act and the amounts to be authorised for payment out of the Welsh Consolidated Fund under section 125(1)(c).

The following additional information has been made available to Members:

An explanatory note on changes between Draft Budget proposals and the Annual Budget.

Supporting documents:

Annual Budget 2012 - 2013
Research Paper for the Final Budget 2012-13

Voting in the motion under this item was deferred until Voting Time. 

The result was as follows:

 The motion was agreed.

FIN(4)-09-11 (P1)

3.1 The Committee reviewed its process of scrutinising the Welsh Government Draft Budget 2012-2013.

FIN(4)-09-11 (p2)

4.1 The Committee discussed the proposal of developing a written protocol with the Welsh Government to ensure transparency of future draft budgets.

Jane Hutt, Minister for Finance  
Michael Hearty, Director General, Strategic Planning Finance & Performance.

Jo Salway, Acting Deputy Director of Strategic Budgeting 

2.1 The Committee welcomed Jane Hutt AM, Minister for Finance; Andrew Jeffries, Head of Strategic Budgeting – Strategic Planning, Finance and Performance; Jeff Andrews, Specialist Policy Adviser; and Jo Salway, Acting Deputy Director of Strategic Budgeting.

2.2 The Committee scrutinised the Minister.

Action points:

The Minister for Finance agreed to provide:

·         A note clarifying the potential impact of Treasury rules on the Welsh block and how the Welsh Government is assisting local government’s borrowing powers to boost capital investment.

·         A note on the process for Equality Impact Assessments in the 2012-2013 budget round.

2.3 The Committee agreed to write to the Permanent Secretary to request further information on the increase in staff costs in the Central Services and Administration (CSA) MEG, explaining what services were involved and the reasons for the increase.

4.1 Members discussed the evidence received on the Welsh Government’s draft budget 2012-2013.

5.1 The Committee considered the evidence it had heard.

HSC(4)-08-11 paper 2

Lesley Griffiths AM, Minister for Health and Social Services

Gwenda Thomas AM, Deputy Minister for Children and Social Services

Chris Hurst, Director of Resources

Steve Milsom, Deputy Director, Adult Social Services Policy

3.1 The Minister for Health and Social Services responded to questions from members of the Committee on the draft budget for 2012-13.

3.2 The Minister agreed to provide additional information on ringfenced funding for mental health services, and a breakdown of how the additional £83m is to be allocated to health boards.

3.3 The Minister agreed to provide information on the impact of free prescriptions.

3.4 The Deputy Minister for Children and Social Services responded to questions from members of the Committee on the draft budget for 2012-13.

3.5 The Deputy Minister agreed to share with the Committee a report by local authorities on the adequacy of funding for the first steps improvement pack when available.

5.1 The Committee discussed the evidence on the Welsh Government Draft Budget 2012-2013.

FIN(4)-06-11 – Paper 1

Helen Birthwhistle, Director, Welsh NHS Confederation

3.1 The Committee welcomed Helen Birthwhistle, Director of Welsh NHS Confederation.

3.2 The Committee questioned the witness.

Action point:

The Welsh NHS Confederation agreed to provide:

·         A note on efficiency savings being made by the NHS and how they can be sustained in the long term.

Carl Sargeant, Minister for Local Government and Communities
Reg Kilpatrick, Director Local Government and Public Services

2.1 The Chair invited Carl Sargeant, Minister for Local Government and Communities and Reg Kilpatrick, Director, Local Government and Public Services.

2.2 The Committee scrutinised the Minister.

Action points:

The Minister agreed to provide:

·         Work-plans which will be discussed by the Public Service Leadership Group at its forthcoming meeting.

·         A list of the successful local authorities which have accessed Invest-to-Save funding and details of successful case studies.

5.1 The Committee discussed the draft letters to the Minister for Business, Enterprise, Technoolgy and Science; and the Minister for Education and Skills.

Carl Sargeant, Minister for Local Government and Communities

2.1 The Chair welcomed the Minister and his officials to the meeting.  Members questioned the Minister.

2.2 The Minister agreed to provide further information on:

• The monitoring tools used by your department to demonstrate success within the National Transport Plan
• An update on the Welsh Government’s negotiations regarding potential funding for the electrification of the Great Western mainline to Swansea.
• Clarification on how the non-cash amounts of the budget are set
• A progress report on the smart card initiative

E&S(4)-07-11 paper 2

John Griffiths AM, Minister for Environment and Sustainable Development

Matthew Quinn, Director, Environment and Sustainable Development

Christianne Glossop, Chief Veterinary Officer

3.1 The Minister for Environment and Sustainable Development and his officials responded to questions from members of the Committee.

3.2 The Minister agreed to provide additional information on anaerobic digestion and a breakdown of the costs involved in the creation of a single environment body.

Leighton Andrews, Minister for Education and Skills

Jeff Cuthbert, Deputy Minister for Skills

Gwen Kohler, Head of Corporate Planning, Performance & Financial Management

Chris Tweedale, Director of Schools and Young People Group

2.1 The Chair welcomed the Minister, the Deputy Minister and their officials to the meeting. Members questioned the witnesses.

2.2 The Minister agreed to provide further information on local authority spending on nursery education.

Lesley Griffiths, Minister for Health and Social Services

Gwenda Thomas, Deputy Minister for Children and Social Services

Martin Swain, Head of Children & Young People Strategy Division

Steve Milsom, Deputy Director Adult Social Services Policy

3.1 The Chair welcomed the Minister, Deputy Minister and their officials to the meeting. Members questioned the witnesses.

3.2 The Minister agreed to provide further information on:

·        The total expenditure on the provision of wheelchairs for children

·        The changes made to the funding arrangements for third sector organisations that provide child and family services across Wales.

CELG(4)-06-11 : Paper 2

·         Emyr Roberts, Director General, Department for Education and Skills

·         Ceinwen Jones, Head of Welsh Language Development Unit

The Minister agreed to provide a note on the Welsh Language screening policy within his department and within other Ministerial portfolios.

CELG(4)-06-11 : Paper 1

·         Reg Kilpatrick, Director, Local Government and Public Service

·         Owain Lloyd, Acting Deputy Director, Operations Team, LGC

The Minister agreed to provide a note on how much each Local Authority received from the additional £54 million funding allocated for equal pay settlements and detail on if it was used for this purpose.  

The Minister agreed to keep the Committee updated on any developments in relation to the introduction of legislation with regard to equal pay settlements.

The Minister agreed to provide a note on discussions with the WCVA regarding the structure and streamlining of organisations in the provision of services.

The Minister agreed to provide a note on the process of providing additional Police Community Support Officers.

The Minister agreed to provide a note on what effect will the 9.2% real terms cut in the substance misuse capital funding will have on the ability of the Welsh Government to deliver the targets in the Working Together to Reduce Harm strategy.

CELG(4)-06-11 : Paper 3

·         Roger Pride, Director of Marketing, BETS

The Minister agreed to provide a detailed list of the events they have supported outside Cardiff and proposed future events. 

Welsh Government (09.30 – 11.00)

CELG(4)-05-11 (p1)

CELG(4)-05-11 (p2)

·         Jane Hutt AM, Minister for Finance and Leader of the House (09.30 – 10.00)

·         Amelia John , Head of Equality, Diversity and Inclusion Division

·         Claire McDonald, Head of the Equality Unit

·         Huw Lewis AM, Minister for Housing, Regeneration and Heritage (10.00 – 11.00)

·         John Howells - Director of Housing, Regeneration & Heritage Department

·         Kath Palmer – Deputy Director, Housing Department

2.1 The Chair welcomed the Minister for Finance, the Minister for Housing, Regeneration and Heritage and Officials.

E&S(4)-06-11 paper 1

Alun Davies AM, Deputy Minister for Agriculture, Fisheries, Food and European Programmes

Rory O'Sullivan, Director Rural Affairs

Brian Pickett, Head of Finance, Rural Affairs, Tourism and Marketing

2.1 The Deputy Minister and officials responded to questions from the Committee on the Welsh Government’s draft budget for 2012-13.

2.2 The Deputy Minister agreed to provide additional information on the sustainability impact assessment undertaken on the draft budget proposals, the young entrants scheme, the food strategy and the review of enforcement activities on marine and fisheries legislation.

5.1 Members discussed the evidence received on the Welsh Government’s draft budget 2012-2013.

FIN-05-11 – Paper 1, Annex A, Annex B, Annex C

Jane Hutt Minister for Finance and Leader of the House
Andrew Jeffreys Head of Strategic Budgeting -Strategic Planning, Finance & Performance 
Jeff Andrews Specialist Policy Adviser, SPF&P
Michael Hearty Director General, Strategic Planning, Finance and Performance

2.1 The Committee welcomed Jane Hutt AM, Minister for Finance; Andrew Jeffries, Head of Strategic Budgeting – Strategic Planning, Finance and Performance; Jeff Andrews, Specialist Policy Adviser; and Michael Hearty, Director General, Strategic Planning, Finance and Performance.

2.2 The Committee scrutinised the Minister.

Action points:

The Minister for Finance agreed to provide:

·         Clarification on the additional allocations made to support the Government’s strategic priorities.

·         Figures outlining the number of people in Wales who pay full council tax and the percentage which are receiving a reduction in benefits, including the council tax collection rates.

·         Further details on which capital programmes will be used for the delivery of the 10 year national infrastructure plan and who will be responsible for directing those funds.

FIN(4)-05-11 Paper 2

Welsh Government Draft Budget 2012-2013 - Evidence from Welsh Council for Voluntary Action

Michelle Matheron, Senior Policy Officer, WCVA

Phil Fiander, Director of Programmes, WCVA

Joy Kent, Director, Cymorth Cymru

Catriona Williams, Chief Executive, Children in Wales

3.1 The Committee welcomed Phil Fiander, Director of Programmes WCVA; Michelle Matheron, Senior Policy Officer, WCVA; Joy Kent, Director, Cymorth Cymru; and Catriona Williams, Chief Executive, Children in Wales.

3.2 The Committee questioned the witnesses.

Action point:

The WCVA agreed to provide:

·         A breakdown of funding available for third sector organisations, outlining the effect that it has on the ability of specific third sector organisations to mobilise and lever in additional resources. This would include figures on the proportions of voluntary sector funding originating from grants, competitively procured contracts, etc.

·         Information from the most recent WCVA ‘recession survey’ on the increased demand being experienced by voluntary sector services.

Edwina Hart, Minister for Business, Enterprise, Technology and Science

James Price, Director General, BETS
Rob Hunter, Deputy Director, Finance and Corporate Services

3.1 The Chair welcomed the Minister for Business, Enterprise, Technology and Science, and her officials to the meeting. Members questioned the Minister.

3.2 The Minister for Business, Enterprise, Technology and Science agreed to send the Committee:

·                     A note on the budget transfers that have taken place so far within the differing areas of the Minister’s portfolio.

·                     A paper on the repayable business finance scheme

·                     Details of any successful projects and what savings will be achieved as a consequence of these, in relation to the Invest-to-Save and Efficiency and Innovation Programme.

Leighton Andrews, Minister for Education and Skills

Jeff Cuthbert, Deputy Minister for Skills

2.1 The Chair welcomed Leighton Andrews AM, Minister for Education and Skills, and Jeff Cuthbert AM, Deputy Minister for Skills to the meeting. Members questioned the Ministers.

2.2 The Minister for Education and Skills agreed to send the Committee:

• Examples of college mergers that have provided savings.
• Figures on the additional funding required to cover the rise in tuition fees for Welsh students and where this additional funding has come from.
• A note on the funding increase for Coleg Ffederal and the University Heads of the Valleys Institute.
• A note on whether the budget allocation for the Welsh Language Delivery Unit is to be used for Welsh adult learners.
• A note on the budget allocation for Mudiad Ysgolion Meithrin

1.1 The Committee held a roundtable discussion with health and social care representatives on the draft budget for 2012-13.

5.1 The Committee agreed its draft report on the Welsh Government’s proposal to change the draft budget motion 2012-2013, which would be published shortly.

6.1 The Committee noted the timescales for committee consideration of the Government’s draft budget.

(11.00-11.10)

4.1 The Committee considered the evidence provided by the witnesses.

(10.15 – 11.00)

FIN(4)-03-11 (Paper 2) - Welsh local Government Association

Steve Thomas CBE, Chief Executive, Welsh Local Government Association

Cllr Rodney Berman, WLGA Finance Spokesperson and Leader, Cardiff County Council

Vanessa Phillips, Director of Resources, Welsh Local Government Association

3.1 The Committee welcomed Steve Thomas, Chief Executive, WLGA; Cllr Rodney Berman, WLGA Finance Spokesperson and Leader, Cardiff County Council; and Vanessa Phillips, Director of Resources WLGA.

3.2 The Committee questioned the witnesses.

Action points:

The Welsh Local Government Association agreed to provide:

·         Further details on efficiency savings made by the Welsh Government’s efficiency and innovation and invest to save programmes.

·         Figures highlighting the level of reserves in place for local authorities and the implications of the reduction in those reserves.

·         A note on how Cymorth and other specific grants within last year’s local government settlement have helped reduce the administrative burden of hypothecated grants.

·         A note on the outcome of the meeting between the WLGA and Welsh Fire and Rescue Services regarding the pension abatement service.

(09.35 – 10.15)

FIN(4)-03-11 (Paper 1, Annex A) – Welsh Government

Jane Hutt AM, Minister for Finance
Andrew Jeffreys, Head of Strategic Budgeting 

Jo Salway, Head of Budget Policy.

Jeff Andrews, Specialist Policy Adviser, Finance

2.1 The Committee welcomed Jane Hutt AM, Minister for Finance; Andrew Jeffreys, Head of Strategic Budgeting; Jo Salway, Head of Budget Policy; and Jeff Andrews, Specialist Policy Adviser – Finance to the meeting.

2.2 The Committee scrutinised the Minister.

2.3 The Committee requested that the Clerk produce a report on its consideration of the Minister’s proposals for amending the Welsh Government Annual Budget Motion.

HSC(4)-03-11 paper 3

4.1 The Committee agreed that it would hold a private roundtable discussion with stakeholders prior to its evidence session with the Minister for Health and Social Services and the Deputy Minister for Social Services on the draft budget for 2012-13.

The Business Committee noted a letter from the Chair of the Finance Committee regarding the deadline for the Finance Committee to report on the draft budget 2012 – 2013 but agreed a deadline of 8 November 2011. The Business Committee agreed to publish the timetable for the consideration of the budget, in accordance with Standing Order 20.4.